Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

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Peter Street
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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

I have read Mr Padgett's  arguments for supposing that Elgar concealed the identity of 'Ein Feste Burg" as the 'larger theme' of his Variations on the grounds that he couldn't admit to using such a famously anti-Catholic theme.  I haven't increased my putative bet against his solution, but I don't withdraw it.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Correction - Dan the bulldog falls into the Wye, not the Severn, in the variations.   Wagner's Rhine will have to be shifted a bit further west, too.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

And Lady Elgar's account of the origins of the composition suggests that the spirit of "fun" at least began by focussing on Elgar's friends, rather than a mathematical jape.   If "Enigma", the Theme, is built on a cryptic reference to 'pi', the 'enigma' must be coincidence, not construction.   But the variations which flow from it, a construction, certainly do represent a "circle".

Welcome to the Enigma discussion.  You have made several excellent observations but I would suggest you consider that Elgar was very fond of japes and the 1897 Indiana Pi Bill would have greatly amused him.  As he was also fond of puzzle and nursery rhymes, I find the Pi theory to be very easy to believe.  Elgar wrote in 1910 that his variations were begun in a spirit of humor.  Could he have worked on a melody based on elements of Pi.  In the first six bars we can find decimal Pi, fractional Pi, and a nursery rhyme pun about Pi.  Elgar added a double bar after the sixth bar indicating perhaps the end of the enigma.  There are exactly Four and twenty blacknotes baked in Elgar's Pi.  Too much for me to believe it is a coincidence.  What think you?

 

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Peter Street
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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Sorry this has to be brief, and CR Santa will certainly not be satisfied.   First- the falling seventh is one of the key characteristics of Elgar's melodic style, especially for grand and public themes.   This does at first, superficially, make it rather odd he should draw attention to it here in his later note.   But it is a leading feature of his theme, which is going to be varied intensively, and any analyst would do the same.   Other characteristics are the inversions,  which might be argued to be constructivist, and, equally, improvisatory devices, and the rising scale in the cello part which is its root, and doesn't obviously relate to pi - or 24.  But the scale does suggest how the improvisation which Lady Elgar describes may have come about.  Both g minor and B flat tend to encourage composers to use melodies or themes constructed in thirds.   As for the numeric significance, if pi is the solution to the enigma, then only the first bar of the first six matters.   Now that falls well within the area in which chance and coincidence must be taken into account.  Six bars of 4/4 might well generate 24-note themes in any case.  Which might suggest the double bar has another, purely musical, significance.  Double bars occur in several of the variations and the finale, and none of these seem to relate to non-musical issues.  In at least one variation, the varied section of Elgar's theme following the double bar is repeated, representing, it would seem, a tricyclist.  I'm not going to suggest an enigmatic pun in that.

Is there any independent evidence at all that Elgar even knew about the Indiana Pi Bill?   Do he or his friends mention it in correspondence or memoirs?   

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

As for the numeric significance, if pi is the solution to the enigma, then only the first bar of the first six matters.   Now that falls well within the area in which chance and coincidence must be taken into account.  Six bars of 4/4 might well generate 24-note themes in any case.  

Although you make a number of good points, I believe you have not fully appreciated that Elgar used three references to Pi in the first six bars, not just one in the first measure.  He included fractional Pi, 22/7, by adding the two drops of a seventh after the first 11 notes giving us 11 x 2/7 = 22/7.  He is well known to have enjoyed puns and nursery rhymes so it is probably not a coincidence that he also used "Four and twenty" black notes baked in his Pi.  One of these might be a coincidence, but I hardly believe all three can be a coincidence.  Pi also can easily fit the clues Elgar gave in 1899 about the "dark saying" (blackbirds are dark) and that the Theme is not played.  Pi is a Theme in the literary sense, the central idea of the enigma.

I also find it more than a coincidence that Elgar wrote in 1929 three sentences, each of which can be related to Pi.  Do you believe these are all coincidences?

 

 

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Peter Street
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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

My line of thought is as follows.   If the role of pi is as you think it to be, the concept behind the work, then how did it get there?  The first bar of the theme, where the decimal value seems, either by accident or design, to be present, is the one that most needs explanation.   Your scenario would be more likely, I suggest, if Elgar had, when sketching what he had improvised, spotted what was probably a coincidence, and decided to work on it.   Though it's possible, I would suggest it's unlikely that he set out - even in a spirit of fun - to see if he could compose a theme, let alone an extended work, based on the decimal formula for pi followed by the fractional formula.   If Lady Elgar's account is right, he had almost immediately begun to treat his initial improvisation as a basis for musical character sketches of his friends.   But given his well known interest in ciphers, and puns, it might very well have amused him to find, if in fact he did, that his theme had twenty four notes and had arisen from a cell in which pi might have turned up.    However, he's not known for many musical ciphers, though, to be fair, his interest in ciphers as such seems not to have been a consistent theme throughout his life.   And most of the instances of it seem not to have been numerical.   I don't know the pianola roll notes, but presumably they don't consist just of three sentences, and what you quote is equally explicable in terms of musical analysis.   I could go further. The structure of the theme itself, I suggest, is against you. For example, the 2:2 pattern is present in his opening phrase, which is followed by a free mirror retrograde.  The first of the falling sevenths is on the octave, and it's a natural consequence and culmination of the rising scale underlying the opening four phrases.  The second seventh, a mirror phrase too, is on the next downward degree of the scale, and another two mirror phrases complete the first part of the theme, six bars long and constructed of three pairs.  The nature of song, which Samuel Langford apparently claimed was the only musical theory he had ever learned, is to go up and down. The key harmonic event, the B natural in the bass, does lie immediately after the sixth rising degree of the scale, but it occurs only once.  To suggest that this piece of composing is the result of a deliberate attempt to encode a complex mathematical reference might be seen as pushing it a bit.  Before Elgar, the best known musical ciphers are from his hero, Schumann.  Like BACH, they are alphabetical, and employ a single code.  If you are right, Elgar used not one but two code conventions inside six bars.  I'm not sure about the propriety of changing the code so soon in the message, but I'm not a cryptologist, and it may be quite OK.  But Elgar is said to have been quite convinced that the work's secrets would be decoded as soon as the Variations had been performed, and this was long before  computers.  You would have to be a pretty good listener to crack a numerical cipher from a twenty-eight second single exposure, (at the beginning of a new and brilliant half-hour work) of which half was coded in scale degrees and the other in intervals and numerical series.  On the other hand, he did once expect Dorabella to crack an Ogham-based message which hasn't yet been decoded in any plausible way.  (Did he ever decode it for her?) Some jape.  Some composer.   But my instinct is still that the solution, whatever it is, is musical.    Now if Elgar showed a documented interest in pi about this time, that might change things a bit.   Did he?

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Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

You said, "You would have to be a pretty good listener to crack a numerical cipher from a twenty-eight second single exposure, (at the beginning of a new and brilliant half-hour work) of which half was coded in scale degrees and the other in intervals and numerical series."

I am a retired chemical engineer, not a musician, but I figured out that the first four notes were scale degree 3-1-4-2.  In my church choir we used to warm up using scales like do-re-mi-fa or 1-2-3-4.  From that I tried 3-1-4-2 and found the opening four notes.  I also noticed that Pi fit the clues about the theme not being played and its being offstage. 

I spent two years researching Elgar and his enigma during which time I found the hint about the drop of the two sevenths in the third and fourth bar led to the discovery of 11x2/7=22/7.  I also noticed that 22/7 was hinted at in each line of his 1929 notes:

Elgar wrote the following in a set of notes issued with the Aeolian Company pianola rolls published in 1929:

The alternation of the two quavers and two crotchets in the first bar and their reversal in the second bar will be noticed; references to this grouping are almost continuous (either melodically or in the accompanying figures - in Variation XIII, beginning at bar 11 [503], for example). The drop of a seventh in the Theme (bars 3 and 4) should be observed. At bar 7 (G major) appears the rising and falling passage in thirds which is much used later, e.g. Variation III, bars 10.16. [106, 112] - E.E.
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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

On the other hand, he did once expect Dorabella to crack an Ogham-based message which hasn't yet been decoded in any plausible way.  (Did he ever decode it for her?) Some jape.  Some composer.   But my instinct is still that the solution, whatever it is, is musical.    Now if Elgar showed a documented interest in pi about this time, that might change things a bit.   Did he?

Elgar never decoded the Dorabella Cipher or his famous "enigma" but he left us some confirming hints in his 1929 notes- three hints in three sentences.  That is quite a coincidence after no one had solved his enigma for 30 years and many of his friends had died or were close to death.

My research never found a documented interest in Pi, but his interest in japes, puzzles, nursery rhymes, and puns is well documented and totally in his character.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

This has nothing to do with anything, but it's extraordinary that you should mention tonic sol fa in this context.   I spent some time yesterday musing about the coincidence that Dora Penny's given name is, in tonic sol fa, the beginning of a scale.   The 'la' in 'Dorabella' is a sixth above 'Do', not a seventh, and so far I can't see that Elgar made any use of any of this in the Dorabella variation, which seems to refer to "E amore un ladroncello" in "Cosi".   But I'm having to consult the score online, which isn't the easiest way of doing it.

I was actually thinking of folk who heard the Enigma in the concert hall for the first time under Richter and their chances of decoding anything at all at first hearing, which is what Elgar seems to have feared would happen.   True, they would have probably have been acquainted with tonic sol fa, and the first bar (especially if there were analytical notes with examples, which seems to have been the case) would probably have tempted a few to try it out.   But, even if you are right, tonic sol fa would not have helped with with 22 over seven.   

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Sorry - I should have thanked you for quoting the 1929 Aeolian note sentences in full.   But with the best will in the world, I can't see that they mean anything other than what they appear, at first reading, to say.   Elgar is simply deconstructing his theme so that readers can follow what he does with it in the composition, and in a very formal and academic prose, since he knows what pedagogues will make of it if he isn't impersonal.  One of the endearing things about Vaughan Williams is that when he writes notes, they gently send up the whole programme note industry, but Elgar, for all his love of japes, wouldn't have risked it in this sort of context.  Interestingly (the Dorabella variation just won't go away) the first published arrangement for piano, which I think is still in print, doesn't accent the first note of the groups of four in the woodwind parts at the beginning of Dorabella, and throughout, at all, (it's usually held for a fraction longer than the other three) and which can prove, in the orchestral score, a minefield for conductors.   I wonder what happened on the piano roll.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

I was actually thinking of folk who heard the Enigma in the concert hall for the first time under Richter and their chances of decoding anything at all at first hearing, which is what Elgar seems to have feared would happen.   True, they would have probably have been acquainted with tonic sol fa, and the first bar (especially if there were analytical notes with examples, which seems to have been the case) would probably have tempted a few to try it out.   But, even if you are right, tonic sol fa would not have helped with with 22 over seven.   

You are correct in your observation that the tonic sol fa would not have helped people to find the 22/7.  Elgar probably didn't expect them to find that or even to find the "Four and twenty blackbirds" baked in his Pi.  He probably expected that people would consider that his riddle about his circle of friends might have something to do with a circle.  Pi is a constant in all circles and 3-1-4-2 scale degree are the first four notes.  This coupled with his saying that the "theme was not played" and stating that the theme was "offstage" were enough for me to conclude that the enigma was probably Pi.  These thoughts all occurred to me the first time I heard it on Performance Today.  Elgar didn't expect people to solve his enigma from his "dark saying" hint which he said, "shall remain unguessed."  In any event, once one suspects that Pi is the enigma it is prudent to look for confirming evidence which I find to be abundant.  His 1929 hints point to the two sevenths in the 3rd and 4th bar which lead one to find 11 x 2/7 = 22/7.  Knowing Elgar's fondness for nursery rhymes and puns lead one to find, "Four and twenty blackbirds baked in a pie (Pi).  The hint at 2 and 2, and the hint at /7 are further confirming evidence that Pi is not just a coincidence but was his intention.  Further evidence/coincidence is that his enigma was written in the year following the great jape, The Indiana Pi Bill, which attempted to legislated the value of Pi.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

Sorry - I should have thanked you for quoting the 1929 Aeolian note sentences in full.   But with the best will in the world, I can't see that they mean anything other than what they appear, at first reading, to say.   Elgar is simply deconstructing his theme so that readers can follow what he does with it in the composition, and in a very formal and academic prose, since he knows what pedagogues will make of it if he isn't impersonal.

Can you believe it was just coincidence that his first sentence refers to 2 and 2 (22), and his second sentence refers to his 2/7 in the third and fourth bar, and his third sentence refers to bar seven (/7)?   I find that so many coincidences lead me to conclude that this was intentional.  In order to make it an interesting riddle he used mis-direction and double meaning in his words.  All coincidences?

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

But all the references in the three sentences you quote are to obvious events in the theme.   I'm sorry to be dense, but it seems to me that if the cipher you suggest were not, in fact, present at all, Elgar would have written precisely the same words.  For a clue, the ambiguity rating for that is a bit high, surely? Are you arguing that the theme was itself composed out of set purpose as a cipher for the two modes of pi?   In which case, since a circle of friends is a circumference, shouldn't we be looking for 2 pi r, or pi d?  Mind you, if either does turn up, I might be fairly close to having to eat my hat!

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Scepticism severely dented by the curse of the Elgar jape.   The melodic note immediately following 3.142 is D!  And, though this really is stretching things beyond breaking point, the old English notation for 'penny'. Now I wonder.  What is the best way to cook a hat?  And do you really need 22 over 7?  I don't think yet that pi can be the primary solution, but it is certainly worth a lot more thought.

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RE: Edward Elgar's Enigma- Solution and Confirmation

Peter Street wrote:

But all the references in the three sentences you quote are to obvious events in the theme.   I'm sorry to be dense, but it seems to me that if the cipher you suggest were not, in fact, present at all, Elgar would have written precisely the same words.  

That is the genius of Elgar's carefully chosen words.  That is why Pi was not discovered for 111 years.  The items Elgar points out are extremely trivial and superficial.  "The first bar has two quavers and two crotchets."  That is so obvious as to be unnecessary unless it was tied to some greater significance which it was not.  "The drop of the seventh in the 3rd and 4th bar should be observed."  Again, observed for what purpose?  Elgar does not elaborate on their significance because he only wanted to give us a hint at the "2/7" which was part of his enigma but difficult to find. Julian Rushton in his book on the enigma variations suggested that any solution must confront the significance of this "hint."

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