The Best Books on Classical Music
Mon, Jan 2 2012, 12:14AM
#2
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
partsong “The other one I have is entitled: Modern Music: The Avant Garde since 1945 (Dent 1981 hardback, re-printed 1986 - I presume the same one as the one you mention?)”
That’s probably it. There is now a 3rd edition which is just called ‘Modern Music and After’. About a hundred pages or more were added since the last edition. Worth checking out.
Thanks for mentioning ‘The New Music: The Avant Garde since 1945’. I will certainly check it out despite its deficiency of recent music.
Some more books on 20th century music that I recently found:
‘The Cambridge History of Twentieth-Century Music’ by Cambridge University
‘Norton Anthology of Western Music, Vol. 3: Twentieth Century [6th edition]’ by J. Peter Burkholder
‘Music in the Early Twentieth Century: The Oxford History of Western Music’ by Richard Taruskin
‘Music in the Late Twentieth Century: The Oxford History of Western Music’ by Richard Taruskin
‘Noise, Water, Meat: A History of Sound in the Arts’ by Douglas Kahn
Mon, Jan 2 2012, 9:01AM
#3
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Thanks FW. I will look into some of your good suggestions as well. I think I need to have a look at this Alex Ross for starters!
Regards
Mark
Tue, Jan 3 2012, 8:04AM
#4
RE:
And I would urge you (and everyone else) to check out Alex Ross’ The Rest is Noise – it’s one of the best books about twentieth century music I’ve come across. It’s a huge book, but always fascinating, whether discussing the premiere of the Rite of Spring or the odd friendship that developed between George Gershwin and Bela Bartok.
Don't you mean Gershwin and Alban Berg?
Oops! It was of course Gershwin and Berg. My fault for not cutting and pasting from Wikipedia and passing it off as my own thoughts.
Tue, Jan 3 2012, 5:34PM
#5
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Thanks FW. I will look into some of your good suggestions as well. I think I need to have a look at this Alex Ross for starters!
Try his blog Mark, http://www.therestisnoise.com/
Tue, Jan 3 2012, 5:57PM
#6
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
I guess now that we know about the "odd friendship" of Gershwin and Berg (not Bartok) will help us understand why the former composed his Prelude No.2 and the latter his Chamber Concerto.
In the same way, reading the very intriguing book of David B. Dennis "Beethoven in German Politics" (Yale University Press) will get us to the very point of the Allegretto of the Seventh Symphony or the slow movement of Hammerklavier.
On the other hand, a book form a composer himself, like Rameau's "Treatise on Harmony" (Dover Publications) will provide us some unnecessary facts (probably boring) about Classical Music itself. In the same vein, the "ABC of Music" by Imogen Holst (Oxford University Press, 1996) is only a pedantic book on the basic facts and figures in Music, that we command so well.
Maybe, "The Shaping Forces of Music" by the composer Ernst Toch (Dover Publications, 1977) might have some thoughtful insights as well as the "Experiencing Music" by Vagn Holmboe - with itroductory remarks by Robert Simpson - (Toccata Press, 1994). Who knows, perhaps "Structural Hearing: Tonal Coherence in Music" by Heinrich Schenker (Dover Publications, 1952) could be more than an opinion book, dealing with the facts of the importance of Harmony and Coherence in Music, if eventually that matters to us.
The other day, I read a whole essay of a Japanese music critic on Piano Music of Schubert. Then, I listened to a mere Allegretto in c minor, D.915 (a very late work of 4 and half minutes) and what I "learned" about the music of the great Franz was not covered in the essay, even as a hint. Fortunately, with Great composers, music speaks for itself; for some others, we need some explanations, opinions and some more...assistance.
Parla
Wed, Jan 4 2012, 6:11PM
#7
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Parla wrote:
So, if you need books on music or for classical music in particular, read first books from the composers themselves (there are some) or from musicians (there are plenty), not from opinionists or even worse opinion-makers. In other words, learn the music first, not about music.
You know Parla, I do like books about music. Books about music often contain information which helps me to be er...informed.
Now books also contain facts and opinions. We can usually spot the difference, and the facts can be useful also.
Some books take years of something called research apparently, and they often also show scholarship and expertise. These can be useful too.
When I was an undergraduate, we used to read books, and lots of them. As I was an English Literature student, we were often advised that there were things we needed to read called texts, which were contained in books.
There were also other books which I called 'the other books'. These were books about books, in which learned and wise people explained things that were in the books that we did not understand. These authors were mysteriously referred to as 'critics'. BUT their books did often contain research, and scholarship and expertise it must be said.
(Occasionally, an author of one of the other books would be invited to college to give a lecture. You bagged your seat early, and marvelled at such otherwordly scholarship, and duly applauded as if he/she were a concert pianist. And then went out and bought the book...I mean the other book.)
Now, the way it worked in my day was simple; you read the texts, and then wrote your essay, in which you explained in humble terms but as best you could, what the books were about. Sometimes you referred to the other books, and did so ethically by using references and quotations, as you had been taught to.
If the book made sense, fine. If it did not then you could do one of the following:
- sit in a seminar and admit your inferiority, as in 'I don't understand it'
- knock on a cleverer than you fellow student's door and ask them their opinion
- turn to the other books to explain what might have been unfathomable gibberish (See Samuel Beckett's novel 'How It Is'. How it is is fairly incomprehensible, being about two men trying to crawl out of sack in the mud. Ah! Must be an extended metaphor for the human condition.)
Occasionally, you felt brave enough to take an idea from one of the critics and develop it yourself. This was however a futile attempt at thinking for oneself, since your tutor would write something like:
'Interesting essay, blah blah, in whuich you discuss blah blah...Incidentally, I do not fully agree with Professor Prattler's views which you seem to have taken on board. Wholly, in fact...'
Damn it! The tutors were so clever that they knew not just what was in the books but what was in the other books as well!
Nowadays, I am led to believe that it has moved on; it has all gone electronic. Students cut and paste an essay from three different sources online and pass it off as their own. The universities are so baffled by this phenomenom, known as plagiarism, that they are having to develop increasingly sophisticated software to combat it.
Long live books Parla!
Joking aside, your idea about reading books by composers is admirable. I even have a copy of Rimsky Korsakov's book on orchestration, not that I am ever likely to arrange something for orchestra, but no matter, it is a good book.
However Parla, scores are HORRENDOUSLY EXPENSIVE. I have a small number of those, and piano collections etc...
I hope that the printed word is not under threat eventually - seriously.
BELIEVE IN BOOKS PARLA!
And finally Parla, I know nothing about Piazolla. I will do what I have done for years. I will visit my local library, where there is a set of umpteen books called the NEW GROVE. (It is a set of encyclopaedias).I always look up any unheard of composer in there to start with.
Should the set have been removed because no one other than me and a few other anoraks use it, then Parla, I shall have no choice but to come home and look up this composer in er...an online encyclopaedia.
Mark (in somewhat jocular mood)
Thu, Jan 5 2012, 7:23AM
#8
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
It's always fun to read your posts, Mark, particularly when you are in somewhat jocular mood.
Long live books! Believe in Books! A good lesson of your undergraduate years of English literature plus a kind of essay in how books can be useful to the average reader. That's all fine, but not necessarily the case for comprehending Music and Classical Music in particular.
Starting from how HORRENDOUSLY EXPENSIVE are the scores, one may realise why they are the basis (not the whole) of comprehending a specific work and a composer's output. In the same vein, books from composers, musicians and professionals can help you learn first the facts, without necessarily resorting to opinions (see the books of Rameau, C.P.E. Bach, Rimsky-Korsakov, Imogen Holst and quite a few others).
The next step (or concurrently with reading/studying the above material), is to expose yourself to extensive listening to what more or less read (or have read). It's also a very horrendously expensive operation that needs time, money, dedication and most of yourself, in the end.
There is no way to even understand, let alone to comprehend, even the most irrelevant piece of music, unless you listen to it (with the score or with an explanation of the score involved, if possible). As I mention in my previous post, I read recently a very good analysis of Piano music of Schubert, but the impact of listening to a tiny, unknown late piece of the great Franz was far more substantive and to the point than the whole essay. It's like you try to find out, through extensive reading, what is or how good a cherry pie might taste, without having ever eaten one!
Of course, if you have managed to command your knowledge on Classical Music through extensive listening/studying plus learning about scores and the facts of Music itself, you may allow yourself to be exposed to any opinions, if you must. In this case, you can judge their views, explanations or findings in Music, without simply having to resort to the cheap commodity the opinion might end up : if you agree with it, you don't need any explanation, if you don't, you will never ask (or hear/read) for any explanation, anyway.
As for Piazzolla, for God/Haeven/Earth's sake, do not ever try to find out about his music through books. Listen, expose yourself to his music and, then, you let yourself (and maybe me and other members of this forum) know of your findings.
Best wishes as ever,
Parla
Thu, Jan 5 2012, 6:56PM
#9
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Hi Parla.
Let's not debate whether or not we need books! As my last post was a humorous attempt at a defence of books. If we debate that then we really are living in an impoverished culture.
(I do however admire your 'thinking outside the box' by reading books by composers rather than historians as it were.
I don't agree with your dismissal of books as containing mere opinion. That is a reduced reading of them! Books such as those mentioned can usefully provide an overview of a period or genre or whatever in music.
I appreciate the scholarship shown in such books as those mentioned above.)
Anyway, out of respect for FW and others who have contributed, let's get it back to suggesting good books to each other, which is a perfectly valid thread.
Atonal - thanks for the link onto Alex Ross's blog. I enjoyed that. It is a bit quirky!
Another one I forgot to mention to you all is The Rough Guide to Classical Music. Very comprehensive survey. Over 600 pages long, so a good one to 'dip into'. Mine is the 4th edition of 2005 - the one with Sir Simon Rattle on the front cover. It is organised by composer and features a wide number of 20th C figures in there.
Just one puzzling thing - one of the list of contributors is Sarah Harding. I thought she sings in Girls Aloud!
Mark
Thu, Jan 5 2012, 7:48PM
#10
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Atonal - thanks for the link onto Alex Ross's blog. I enjoyed that. It is a bit quirky!
a pleasure
and
Just one puzzling thing - one of the list of contributors is Sarah Harding. I thought she sings in Girls Aloud!
ooh look at you gettin' down wiv da kidz!
Fri, Jan 6 2012, 10:39AM
#11
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Much respect due Atonal! Give it up for da kidz!
M
Sat, Jan 7 2012, 3:37PM
#12
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
...I will visit my local library, where there is a set of umpteen books called the NEW GROVE. (It is a set of encyclopaedias).I always look up any unheard of composer in there to start with.
I went 'back to basics' recently with a book I found in the music section at my local public library: Joining the Dots. a beginner's guide to listening to classical music by Steve Hobson (Dewey 781.17) Steve gives a detailed plan of how he listens to new/unfamiliar music. There's other food for thought for experienced listeners too: '[the book] will not tell you what to think - it will just give you the tools to help you make up your own mind, and provide you with a map to guide you on your musical journey'.
(By the way, my library card number gives access to Oxford Music Online which includes Groves Music Online. There is an entry for Astor Piazzolla but is doesn't say if he's worth listening to ;-)
Sat, Jan 7 2012, 4:28PM
#13
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
That's why, Kev, I mentioned above that you have to listen to the music, before or along with what you read about composers and their works. The "tools" and the "map to guide you" are useful, but your musical journey, through the listening experience, can make you comprehend the music of any composer, including Piazzolla's, and whether he was worth listening to.
Parla
Sat, Jan 7 2012, 8:33PM
#14
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
(By the way, my library card number gives access to Oxford Music Online which includesGroves Music Online. There is an entry for Astor Piazzolla but is doesn't say if he's worth listening to ;-)
Oh, believe me Kev, he's worth listening to just because we're told to. He's 'Great?'
Sun, Jan 8 2012, 12:44PM
#15
RE: The Best Books on Classical Music
Thanks for the info Kev. I wasn't aware of that facility - will check with my own library.
I once looked at joining/subscribing to Grove online myself but it is quite expensive.
Mark
Hi Frostwalrus! Interesting topic.
I am a fan of Griffiths, and like you I have those two books you mention.
Modern Music: A Concise History from Debussy to Boulez is I think a good general guide in which he maps out all the developments in not-too technical language. Yes it is a good overview and introduction to the twentieth-century.
The other one I have is entitled: Modern Music: The Avant Garde since 1945 (Dent 1981 hardback, re-printed 1986 - I presume the same one as the one you mention?)
I like the way he organizes this into the two big sections:The Serial Ascendancy and Music in the 60s and 70s. This book is certainly more for the serious music student, as you say it is more technical and does assume a good knowledge. Lots of good examples from scores.
I do think he is a formidable writer with a very good command of the subject. His book on Ligeti is also worth a visit.
Elsewhere, also of interest though I don't know if you can still get it is:
Reginald Smith-Brindle: The New Music: The Avant Garde since 1945.
Smith-Brindle was apparently an avant-garde composer himself(?). He traces all the separate movements nicely: The Webern Cult, Pointillism, Integral Serialism, Numbers, Free Twelve-Note Music, Indeterminate, Chance and Aleatory, Improvisation, Graphic and Text Scores, Concrete Music, Electronic Music, Cage and other Americans etc...etc...
There are some separate chapters towards the end on Colour - new instrumental usages, The New Choralism and Notation which are also very useful.
Oxford University Press paberback 1975 first published - so yes it does only cover the first three quarters of the century, and for instance we don't get the mention of our friend Holy Minimalism from the last two decades of the century. He kind of just misses out on it, though he does mention Tavener's Cantata 'The Whale' and Peter Maxwell Davies' use of early forms.
The version I have is the fourth impression of 1984.
ISBN 0 19 315424 2
Regards
Mark