Beethoven symphonies
Thu, Sep 1 2011, 3:00PM
#1
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Thu, Sep 1 2011, 5:14PM
#2
RE: Beethoven symphonies RE: Beethoven symphonies
Exactly. What is there to say that hasn't already been said?
Thu, Sep 1 2011, 9:41PM
#3
RE: Beethoven symphonies
.
Sun, Sep 4 2011, 9:08AM
#4
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Eventually, some bright "elusive" and "elliptical" replies on a thread that cannot have an end.
Keep on guys. One day you may agree that the "best" cycle will never exist. In any case, everything in Art (and maybe particularly in classical music!), according to most of you, is a matter of an (undefined) taste.
Parla
Mon, Sep 5 2011, 10:05AM
#5
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Eventually, some bright "elusive" and "elliptical" replies on a thread that cannot have an end.
Keep on guys. One day you may agree that the "best" cycle will never exist. In any case, everything in Art (and maybe particularly in classical music!), according to most of you, is a matter of an (undefined) taste.
Parla
Can you define taste? Can anybody?
Go on then, have a go.
Mon, Sep 5 2011, 3:05PM
#6
RE: Beethoven symphonies
So, one may have to guess that "taste" is as important as "spirit". We can register it, but we cannot describe it.
However, you seem sure what is "good" in this taste exploration. So, do one has to guess that "good" may be defined?
Have a go, troyen1 or anyone else who claims he knows when the taste turns good?
Parla
Tue, Sep 6 2011, 2:47AM
#7
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Has anybody heard the new Riccardo Chailly cycle yet? Any thoughts, if so?
Wed, Sep 14 2011, 9:24PM
#8
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Has anybody heard the new Riccardo Chailly cycle yet? Any thoughts, if so?
Although it won't be released until October, you can now hear substantial previews (one and a half minutes) of all the tracks on iTunes:
http://itunes.apple.com/ie/preorder/beethoven-the-symphonies/id465210779
It's impossible to be definite, but I like the orchestral balances and colours. The tempi are certainly not as controversial as they once would have been - practically middle of the road these days in fact!
Wed, Sep 14 2011, 9:51PM
#9
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Nobody mentions the 1961 recordings by the RPO conducted by René Leibowitz. A Wilkinson/Gerhardt production, with the RPO playing their socks off for a conductor who proves that Beethoven's metronome markings were possible with a modern symphony orchestra when played in the right way. Wonderful performances in Wilkinson sound.
Wed, Sep 14 2011, 10:59PM
#10
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Interesting to read the comment on the Leibowitz Beethoven as I am a great fan of the Wilkinson/Gerhardt discs (where Gerhardt himself successfully took up the baton on occasions) and would like to have heard them but am not sure if they are still available on Chesky. I believe Wilkinson himself considered these "good Beethoven". I do though have a copy of their Mozart "Jupiter" which is superbly played and recorded.
Thu, Sep 15 2011, 7:54AM
#11
RE: Beethoven symphonies
I've been enjoying Hermann Scherchen's LvB cycle recently (Andromena ANDRCD 9078). I came to it expecting the clarity you'd hope for from a conductor who devoted so much of his time to unpicking Schoenberg/Webern et al - and that's there - but also a rawness and unpredictability that I find very exhilarating. I say - go check it!
Thu, Sep 15 2011, 2:30PM
#12
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Perhaps I am in a minority of one but I bought this and was bitterly disappointed. The sound has little immediacy (I accept this may be my system but other CDs are finer) and the performances are OK but little more. I have various complete sets and still revert to individual performances: i.e. Carlos Kleiber in 5 & 7, Klemperer in 2, 3 and 4, Furtwangler in 9 (Lucerne not Bayreuth),Cluytens in 6, Silvestri in 8 (yes I know that's an odd choice!), Harnoncourt in 1. Does this age me? Probably!!
I had completely René Leibowitz - I had this on the old LPs and loved it. I will try & find it again.
Thu, Sep 15 2011, 2:46PM
#13
RE: Beethoven symphonies
Apparently, Gramophone has not reviewed Christian Thielemann's recent Blu-ray/DVD cycle with the VPO. It seems to me that this is a most accomplished set: classic in outlook but far from "dusty", deeply thought out, fiery and contemplative in the right places, and in top-notch HD sound (not to mention the visual opulence of the Musikverein). What's more, Thielemann plays the "lesser" symphonies (e.g, the First and the Second) as if they were as famous and important as the Fifth or the Ninth, giving them his all, and the orchestra follow suit. Any opinions ?
Fri, Sep 23 2011, 11:09AM
#14
RE: Beethoven symphonies
With interest I read your comment on the versions on DVD byTielemann.
I own the still the complete Karajan '62 set, and always looking for other interpretations.
Perhaps you can clarify your remark 'What's more, Thielemann plays the "lesser" symphonies (e.g, the First
and the Second) as if they were as famous and important as the Fifth or
the Ninth'.
How can you hear (or see) that?
HenkLin
Fri, Sep 23 2011, 12:21PM
#15
RE: Beethoven symphonies
HenkLin,
Your point is well taken, so let me try to explain what I said. Naturally, this is not an exact science, but perceptions I get from the visual - even more so than the audio - side of those recordings. The facial expressions and the overall body language of Thielemann and the VPO musicians indicate absolute commitment and intense concentration, regardless of which symphony they are playing. At times, you even get a glimpse of the joy in their music making, with some of the musicians smiling gleefully or casting a mischievous look to Thielemann or to their row colleagues. All of this together, I guess, is what gave me the impression I mentioned. In any event, those filmed performances make for a most rewarding Beethoven experience in my opinion, and that's the message I wanted to convey here.
