Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
Fri, Nov 16 2012, 6:43AM
Commounly we mentioned like best #1 Clifford Curzon-George Szells performance, and like best#2 Sviatoslav Richter-Erich Leinsdorf version, a recording that curiosly Richter in his own words hated! But times have changed and at this time there are 100 or more new recordings of this marvelluos works, and because of that the competition is very fierce to day! Which do you think are the best recordings of this works? In my case I vote for Peter Donohoe-Svetlanov with Philharmonia Orch. like best # 1 (10/9 in "classicstoday" review), a passionate, dinamic and colourful performance, closer to Rudolf Buchbinder-Harnoncourt recording, but Buchbinder seems feeeble or timid in front to a more convincing Donohoe. In #2 my prefered is Emil Gilels-Fritz Reiner's version, but Hans Richter Haaser-Karajan and Geza Anda-Ferenc Fricsay are also excellent versions. Which are yours?? Regards oscar.olavarria
Sat, Nov 17 2012, 2:41PM
#2
I'm quite fond of the early
I'm quite fond of the early 80's recordings of both concertos by Ashkenazy and Haitink, on Decca.
My first encounter with these marvellous works (to me they're the greatest piano concertos ever written, period) was with the old Rudolf Serkin recordings, with Szell and Ormandy If I remember correctly. I wonder if it's worth digging them up somewhere, don't have very clear recollections of those performances.
Sat, Nov 17 2012, 7:53PM
#3
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
We are very fortunate to have an abundance of recordings from all recording periods to trace and chase. Since these two works are some of the most complex, demanding, multifold, profound concertos for Piano, there cannot possibly be a definitive recording or performance. However, some notable ones could be the following (apart from the ones mentioned above):
-For both concertos, one of the two recordings with Kovacevich, probably the one with C. Davis, re-issued by Newton. Very fine and refined performances, more than decent recordings.
-For both, the Moravec/Belohlavek, on Supraphon, released on 2006. Fine both as performances and recordings from a great pianist and a solid conductor.
-For both, the Gilels/Jochum, on DG. With such a pianist and conductor, one has simply to listen and...learn.
-For the First, the historic but great Curzon/Szell recording on Decca. Some inevitable reservations on the old recording.
-For the First, the unknown or overlooked Badura-Skoda/Korobov, on Genuin. For such a pianist, it's worth a try. The recording is recent and live (2008) and sounds very fine.
-For both, with some emphasis on the First, the rather recent (2007) recording of Freire/ Chailly, on Decca. Two great artists and a superb recording.
-For the First, the "first" recording (on SACD) with a very fine period instrument (an Erard of 1853), performed by Hardy Richter (a specialist on period instruments) and conductor Werner Erhardt. On MDG.
-For the Second, the Angelich/P.Jarvi, on Virgin. Very impressive, enhanced by a superlative recording.
-For the Second, the Hamelin/Litton, on Hyperion. Great in all aspects, including the recording (exists in SACD as well).
-For the Second, the Zimmerman/Bernstein, on DG. A very personal but utterly interesting and impressive account, in an convincing recording.
There are many more to explore. The above is an indicative account of some recordings I own and I know.
50m, these Concertos are definitely some of the greatest in the repertory. However, their complexity, the gargantuan length and enough demands for both the orchestra and of course the soloist make them loose some of the immediate effect and the essence of the music of a Bach, Mozart or Beethoven Concerto for the same instrument.
Parla
Sat, Nov 17 2012, 9:25PM
#4
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
Of these two concertos (both of which I think are magnificent) I have always loved the second far more. I am not sure why this is... but it is so.
How can there be one recording of a great piece of music that stands above others? So, I can only offer a personal reference, rather than something else.
For the first I have always enjoyed Brendel/Abbado on Phillips, which is not currently available. For the second I do find myself drawn constantly to the Zimerman/Bernstein recording, which is a live recording (probably with patches) and captures something evry special. The third movement dialogue between piano and cello is truly beautiful.
Sat, Nov 17 2012, 9:40PM
#5
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
I would put forward as best performance of Brahms' 2nd the wartime Edwin Fischer/Wilhelm Furtwangler performance.
Sun, Nov 18 2012, 1:15AM
#6
RE: I'm quite fond of the early
My first encounter with these marvellous works (to me they're the greatest piano concertos ever written, period) was with the old Rudolf Serkin recordings, with Szell and Ormandy If I remember correctly. I wonder if it's worth digging them up somewhere, don't have very clear recollections of those performances.
Coincidentally, I listened to Serkin's recording of the 1st with Szell (Cleveland) today. It isn't all that old; it dates from 1968 and is the only one I have. It sounds fine to me, though having heard this concerto several times live as well as on disc I can't say it's a favourite of mine. Still it was good to hear it again, not having done so for a while.
Sun, Nov 18 2012, 11:53AM
#7
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
"For the First the historic but great Curzon recording on Decca"
Got to agree with Parla - one of the best.Not sure about being historic.In 1953, when Curzon was in his prime, he made his first recording of this work with Van Beinum conducting the Concertgbouw,also on Decca.That is historic, and of course in (fine) mono sound.It is every bit as good as the admired later stereo Szell performance.
Decca it seems have made a few superb Brahms piano concerto recordings.Surprised there has been no mention of Wilhelm Backhaus thus far,he recorded both works more then once.The second with Boehm conducting the Vienna Phil is a classic. Also, again for both and on Decca I have a great admiration for Katchen.
Wed, Nov 21 2012, 10:49PM
#8
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
Agree with HM above on Katchen & Backhaus (both the last and his pre-war with the same partners). Even more remarkable at his age in a work that seems to have seen off two of its interpreters. Richter-Haaser (I agree with Oscar his recording with Karajan is one of the best) collapsed whilst rehearsing it and died shortly afterwards whilst one of its few female interpreters, Gina Bachauer (good Mercury recording) died of a heart attack the afternoon before she was due to play it.
Kovacevich/Sawallisch are excellent in both as is Leonardo Gelber and are Serkin/Szell. Normally an enthusiast for Curzon the performance of the first doesn't gel for me: superb playing and sound from the orchestra but I find the piano sound unimpressive - no match for Katchen. Interesting as presumably both made in the same venue with the same orchestra (I don't know Curzon's earlier version). Agree too with Naupilus regarding Brendel/Abbado (Brendel being the only one amongst those mentioned I've heard play it live).
Fri, Nov 23 2012, 10:15AM
#9
RE: Same venue for Curzon and Katchen.
Out of curiosity I checked on the CHARM website.You are correct 33lp both the Curzon/Szell and Katchen/Monteux Brahms 1st concerto were recorded at the Kingsway Hall,London.
What did surprise me was the Katchen was recorded first,March 1959.The Curzon over three years later May 1962.I always assumed that Curzon preceded Katchen.
Fri, Nov 23 2012, 12:53PM
#10
RE: Same venue for Curzon and Katchen.
Interesting HM - I thought the orchestral sound better on Curzon (Speakers Corner LP) but the piano sound better on Katchen (CD)!
I still regard a recital by Katchen as the finest I have ever attended.
Sat, Nov 24 2012, 9:00PM
#11
RE: Same venue for Curzon and Katchen.
"there cannot possibly be a definitive recording or performance. However, some notable ones could be the following...."(Parla said)
Cear parla, I think that your list (a remarkable effort in all case) is notoriously incomplete, xapart to be -sometimes- innapropriate, because of in #2 where are Richter-Leinsdorf, Geza Anda-Fricsay, Gilels-Reiner, Schnabel-Boult (in historicals versions) Arrau-Giulini recordings??, I think those are more important versions than Hamelin or Angelichs, for example.
About Katchen recordings, I think that Katchen is effectively superlative in Brahms solo piano works, but not in the piano concerts, in # 1 for example I find him unconvincing (and also in # 2) and Monteux with his spontaneus and natural style (he practised very little!), makes an unelaborate accompaniment, and the same goes for hungarian conductor Ferencsik in # 2, osviously he is out from his repertoire in this work.
In # 1 we have forgotted Arrau-Kubelik version in Orfeo, a live recording that is known like a "titans duel", because of serious conflicts between soloist and conductor, an unforgiveable omision, dont you believe it?? oscar.olavarria
Sat, Nov 24 2012, 11:18PM
#12
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
Dear Oscar, my "list" referred to more recent recordings that normally are overlooked or even ignored because of the "historic" mania...You see there are very good recordings of younger pianists, which have the benefit of the pure, bright, transparent, truly dynamic and spacious recordings which work to the very benefit of the work. In the case of Brahms' Concerti, this is absolutely necessary...
Don't forget, I'm an audiophile.
Best wishes,
Parla
Sun, Nov 25 2012, 11:00AM
#13
RE: Brahms' piano concertos, which are the best??
My favourite recordings are Barenboim/Celibidache, followed by Zimerman/Bernstein and Gould/Bernstein (the latter not your "everyday listening" version, but highly original and interesting). I love the Fischer/Furtwängler version of #2 as well. Arrau/Giulini are a very good choice as well.
Sun, Nov 25 2012, 1:56PM
#14
Ferencsik
http://classicstoday.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/coverpic...
Reading your posts Oscar, it is fully apparent that you have an extensive knowledge of classical recordings of the past.That being so,I find your statement "Ferencsik is obviously out of his repertoire in this work" puzzling. I would have thought being born and taught in the Austrian-Hungarian tradition would have made him an ideal accompanist in Brahms.
Sun, Nov 25 2012, 1:58PM
#15
RE: Ferencsik
Apologies - the link was meant to go too a review of the Katchen/Ferencisk CD.
Kun-Woo Paik, Inbal, Chzech PO, on DG for # 1, and Ivan Moravec, Belohlavek, Czech PO, on Supraphon for # 2.
Best, H.
hector