Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement: what music is Ton Koopman playing?
Wed, Feb 27 2013, 3:38AM
In his mid-eighties recording of the Brandenburgs, in the third concerto Ton Koopman chose to supplement Bach's famously bare two chords
with what sounds like a keyboard sarabande. At least in the original Erato pressing which I own, neither he nor the annotator reveals to purchasers and listeners what the added music is. Amazon reviewers on two continents, whether fans or otherwise, evidently consider the matter something of little moment, since none of them evince even the slightest awareness of the presence of something unusual, nor can I any longer find an online review done by someone, presumably more professional, who realizes that the movement is indeed an addition.
I should be most grateful if a knowledgeable reader could enlighten me as to the identity of the inserted movement.
Thu, Feb 28 2013, 1:24AM
#2
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
I've got the cd's and the notes don't mention what's been played for the middle movement. Knowing Koopman he probably improvised something.
Mon, Mar 4 2013, 6:31PM
#3
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
You might try looking on
There is a lot of discussion there on recordings of Bach, not just the cantatas.
Chris
Tue, Mar 5 2013, 8:34PM
#4
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
It's certainly not an improv! Thanks anyway.
Tue, Mar 5 2013, 8:54PM
#5
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Thank you, Chris. I had checked there earlier but found nothing. I checked again, and alas, nothing's changed for the better.
Tue, Mar 5 2013, 10:02PM
#6
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Dear Bliss,
Thanks for this suggestion. I own several recordings of both works Wikipedia lists, but neither of them match.
I just discovered that buried at the bottom of Koopman's website, there is a link marked "Contact". I just wrote a letter to his PA asking her my question. If she writes back with the answer, I'll post the information here.
Tue, Mar 5 2013, 10:25PM
#7
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Hope you find it Thomas! I did check YouTube and you can see a live performance there in which he plays, from music, a harpsichord solo as a middle movement. I don't recognise it and you never get a close enough view of his music stand to see what it is!
I must say I rather agree with Harnoncourt that in a concerto for solo strings, Bach would not have expected a movement for solo keyboard.
Anyway, good luck with his PA!
Wed, Mar 6 2013, 12:24AM
#8
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
It's certainly not an improv! Thanks anyway.
How can you be so sure, Thomas? Knowing Koopman, he probably went for the most "authentic" solution, which in this case would be Bach improvising a bit between the two movements. Of course it's possible he cheated and prepared a piece for the occasion ;)
Wed, Mar 6 2013, 5:02AM
#9
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement:
I also believe that Koopman should have opted for an improvisation, in the style of Bach, as the middle movement of the fast and furious 3rd Brandemburg Concerto.
Let's see, however, what the PA of the esteemed soloist and conductor might have to state.
Parla
Sun, Mar 10 2013, 1:47AM
#10
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Thanks to all for their comments and suggestions. I'm still awaiting a reply from Koopman's PA. I'm sure, however, that she and he have quite enough to do in a typical day without prioritizing a query from a curious Yank.
Are any of you gents current Gramophone subscribers? I ask because now that the mag's owners have withdrawn the archives from general access, only subscribers have access to its riches. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Gramophone (a) reviewed the recording when it was issued and (b) identified the interpolation. If any of you have access, please make use of it and inform the rest of us of what you discover.
Fingers crossed.
Sun, Mar 10 2013, 10:51AM
#11
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Thomas,
Yes, you are right. Found it!
It is the slow movement from the Toccata in G major (BWV916). Quite early Bach.
Chris
http://javanese.imslp.info/files/imglnks/usimg/7/73/IMSLP03206-Bach_-_BG...
Fri, Mar 15 2013, 4:56PM
#12
RE: Brandenburg no. 3's 2nd movement
Dear Chris,
I saw your comment just minutes ago, and I thank you heartily for the research—even more so for the linked score.
Actually, I came to the forum today because I thought that I was going to be the first bearer of the news myself! Koopman's PA, a helpful lady called Dagmar Tengbergen, replied this morning to my query with precisely the same information you were kind enough to provide. I am somewhat abashed to admit that although I own three recordings of the toccatas—two on LP (Kirkpatrick, Gould) and one on CD (Bob van Asperen)—I haven't listened to them at home for roughly twenty years. I am remedying that failing this very day!
Go to Wikipedia.org and search "Brandenburg concertos." They give two selections of Bach that are sometimes used as the middle movement of the 3rd. Of course you'd need to hear them and maybe someone else can help you there. I didn't check YouTube.
Bliss