EMI SACD releases
Sat, Nov 19 2011, 6:09PM
It can only be good news to see EMI Japan releasing a very large number of SA-CDs. These discs are however, very expensive and become more so once you add shipping and any import duties to them. These releases appear to be stereo only and will cost a premium outside of Japan I suspect.
For me SA-CD is very much about improved sound quality and I am prepared to pay a bit more for that, but not necessarily as much as these discs are selling for. Also, I personally am a supporter of SA-CD because it offers the surround multichannel sound option, which to me enhances the music so much more. I find it hard to listen to stereo discs now as the lack depth and I hear less than I do of the music when it is in multichannel.
I think it is interesting that EMI, UMG and Warner perceive a market exists in Japan, but not the rest of the world. I can't help however to feel this is wrong. There are some of us who would like more hybrid SA-CD discs to be available. That said the independent labels such as Alia Vox, Bis, Harmonia Mundi and others do a great job releasing SA-CDs, so it is from these labels I predominantly buy my music, not the major labels.
I hope the Japan SA-CD releases are being watched closely by UMG and EMI elsewhere in the world and it might get them to look again at their global strategy, especially if UMGs proposed takeover of EMI succeeds. We are told we live in an age of choice and consumer led demand. So I have no problem with the move to downloads, I am no fan of these at all, they do not give me what i want, a tangible product and good quality sound. So please offer me and other like me choice and let me have good quality surround recordings on SA-CD. I recently played some SA-CDs to friends who had never heard of the format, they were amazed at the difference and loved it and will now be looking at it themselves. It is not necessarily a case that consumers don't want SA-CD I think, it is rather a case many have not heard of it because it was not marketed well and has not become the norm through hybrid releases.
Sony Music's whole approach towards SA-CD is I feel rather odd, given that their music label has failed to properly support the format. Again, the consequence of this is that I don't buy Sony Music CDs, instead I buy from those labels offering me what I want, so I guess you could argue that I do have some choice, but it would just be nice if the majors participated more in being seen to offer choice rather than the giving the perception of chasing larger profits all the time.
EMI has a large number of quadraphonic recordings in its vaults, a legacy of their single inventory SQ Quad / Stereo policy in the 1970's. It would be so good if UMG has the vision to produce an audiophile label, not one just based in Japan, selling at a premium price, but a global release of hybrid SA-CDs making available once again these amazing recordings at an affordable price in high quality surround sound. One particular recording which would be most apt for release next year here in the UK is Elgar's Coronation Ode, released in !977 for the Queen's Silver Jubilee would be an appropriate re-release for the Golden Jubilee. That aside, there are many other EMI recordings of this period worthy of SA-CD release in multichannel hybrid format. Let us hope that EMI will have the vision and creativety to think outside the box. I fear that UMG does not appear to be thinking boldly in this way, so there may not be much hope, but it would be good to think that UMG might just revisit its policy and rather than just say that it is commited to high qualiy sound to demonstrate this commitment thrugh the release of high quality SA-CDs. As I say, some of us live in hope...
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 12:12AM
#2
RE: EMI SACD releases
I suspect ChrisV is likely to be disappointed. I think the Japanese market is probably more interested in novel technology than Europe and one can well understand EMI's reluctance to have had a second attempt at introducing a technology which failed public acceptance previously. I have a small number of quadraphonic EMI Lps (including the Elgar) but was never tempted to purchase the equipment to play them as such and I think the same situation pertains today for most classical music listeners. DVD-audio introduced around the same time as SACD is now quite dead and SACD barely hangs on. There are very few high quality SACD players available and as I understand it many of these will only play the SACD layer in stereo. Surround sound seems to be ignored by the audiophile/hifi fraternity being consigned solely to the home cinema market which seems to have fragmented and become quite separate from the high quality audio market. ChisV would no doubt disagree; what do others think?
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 11:49AM
#3
RE: EMI SACD releases
No, 33lp, SACD is alive and well, even in Europe. There are quite a few labels, mostly independent and rather small, which, however record exclusively (or almost) on the SACD format (Praga Digitals, Pentatone, Linn, Channell Classics, BIS, Challenge, Myrios, etc.). I admit that the big scale companies have to sell; so, they cannot waste effort and money on something more exclusive, expensive, which requires a high-end equipment to be justified.
The good (normally at he high-end range) SACD Players (like Krell) can play normal CDs, SACD at stereo layer (which make already a considerable difference), and SACD surround. Of course, it's expensive. So, that's why EMI or Universal or Sony are not going to proceed in Europe. We are a bit stingy, miser and above all too cautious. Of course, we live in terrible times, but, even before the crisis, we used to behave on the very careful side.
Finally, we should not neglect that Esoteric made an amazing transfer of the Solti's Ring on SACD, in a limited edition and at the price of 800-1000 USD! It was sold out, within few months, to US and Japan buyers!
Parla
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 12:28PM
#4
RE: EMI SACD releases RE: EMI SACD releases
The good (normally at he high-end range) SACD Players (like Krell) can play normal CDs, SACD at stereo layer (which make already a considerable difference),
I disagree. There is no evidence that anyone in the world can hear a difference between equivalent CD and SACD stereo layers (i.e. those derived from the same master) under normal (volume) listening conditions. Quite thorough and well controlled scientific tests have clearly shown this to be so. The differences people claim to hear are either a placebo effect, or they are unaware that the CD and SACD versions involve different mixes produced at different times, which would be the case for e.g. the Mercury SACDs that appeared a few years ago.
The only advantages of SACD are the multichannel factor, and for reissues the fact that there is a good chance a better transfer might have been attempted.
Ted
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 1:12PM
#5
RE: EMI SACD releases
Sorry, to disagree, but, as an avid collector, I happen to have quite a few works in both formats and the difference is quite substantive : More ambience, better analysis and greater and more immediate dynamics.
I have the Krell SACD player, which, can show the difference. I don't know about other equipments, but I guess some of the same calibre might perform the same way.
Parla
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 1:20PM
#6
RE: EMI SACD releases
Sorry, to disagree, but, as an avid collector, I happen to have quite a few works in both formats
such as ?
Ted
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 1:51PM
#7
RE: EMI SACD releases
Intriguing that Linn still make a turntable but appear to have stopped manufacturing silver disc spinning machines....
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 3:23PM
#8
RE: EMI SACD releases
Many SACDs do sound way better than their previous incarnations.The most dramatic are the Sony George Szell recordings.His Beethoven Symphony 3 SACD recording,for example,is so much better sounding that it almost seems like a totally different recording!But the RCA Living Stereo series is somewhat of a mixed bag in that these recordings have always sounded great from day one,so the difference is not so apparent.There is no doubt that you have to have a quality SACD player to experience the great sound.Many people think that they can just go out a buy a $150.00 universal player and enter into a sonic nirvana.I learned the hard way myself.I have noticed that many SACDs have great sounding conventional layers that actually sound as good as the SA layer and considerable better than the original stereo release.John Eliot Gardiner`s recording of The Planets and Davis`classic Symphonie Fantastique(1974)are perfect examples due to some great re-mixing.
Sun, Nov 20 2011, 5:25PM
#9
RE: EMI SACD releases
I counted only 7 SACD releases out of about 100 reviews in the current Gramophone; hardly an indication of a thriving medium. I do have a machine that will play SACDs in stereo but it is a budget "all discs" machine sold primarily as a blu-ray player and I don't have any SACDs to check it out; no doubt the above comment will apply. There does though seem to be a dearth of suitable machines in the £500 - £1000 range.
Mon, Nov 21 2011, 7:16AM
#10
RE: EMI SACD releases
Intriguing that Linn still make a turntable but appear to have stopped manufacturing silver disc spinning machines....
Not sure what point you are making about stereo/SACD, 33lp (?)
Vic.
Mon, Nov 21 2011, 1:28PM
#11
RE: EMI SACD releases
Parla pointed out that Linn issue SACD recordings. My point was that if the company does not feel it worth while to manufacture an SACD player they cannot have much confidence in the long term future of SACD as a listening medium.
Mon, Nov 21 2011, 8:03PM
#12
RE: EMI SACD releases
However, 33lp, Linn, whether it has confidence in SACD as listening format, issues 98% of its production recordings in SACD (you can check its catalogue). So, judge by youself.
The fact that the company does not wish to manufacture a SACD player might be explained by the considerable cost of selling it. Truly good and reliable SACD players might cost some thousands of Pounds! (My Krell proved to be quite costly but absolutely worthwhile).
Mon, Nov 21 2011, 11:29PM
#13
RE: EMI SACD releases
However, 33lp, Linn, whether it has confidence in SACD as listening format, issues 98% of its production recordings in SACD (you can check its catalogue). So, judge by youself.
Probably there are financial considerations here. If you read what the owner of BIS Robert von Bahr has said on the matter, he explains that having repertoire on both CD and SACD is undesirable as you end up producing twice as many discs for approximately the same overall sales.
Presumably Linn choose the SACD option as it fits with their audiophile marketing image.
Ted
Tue, Nov 22 2011, 8:05AM
#14
RE: EMI SACD releases
I guess Linn is selling into two markets - software and hardware, music and equipment. There is considerable demand for SACD in the music market but virtually none in the equipment market (that Linn sells to).
I further guess I am a typical Linn customer. Stereo is fine for me and I have no interest in diluting my spending on more equipment for what I consider something of a gimmick. Fine for films, irrelevant for the way I listen to music.
Following my experience recently of Shostakovich’s 7th. at Symphony Hall in Birmingham and later through my Linn hi-fi, I didn't feel I was losing much by not being surrounded by extra channels. I am wowed by what my equipment delivers now. I have no doubt there is a gain, but not sufficient to convince me of the value of investing in it.
Vic.
Sat, Dec 3 2011, 6:00PM
#15
RE: EMI SACD releases
As Ken Kessler says in Hi-Fi News & Record Review, if you can't hear the difference, you need an ear-wax remover. I recently bought a stereo SACD player and have been extremely impressed with the quality difference, which is easy to do by simply comparing the SACD layer on discs with the CD layer.
I don't buy CDs anymore - basically I only purchase SACDs now. There is vastly more hi-rez content on SACD than on downloads (or any other format). I understand there are now more than 7000 titles out now and I am working my way through them. :)
Good post, but why do you feel that they could make money from this? The Japanese market for classical music is much bigger than in the UK, and Universal (e.g. DG) have already tested the water with some hybrid disks, but now seem to have given up, presumably because it wasn't worth it?
Ted