Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
Mon, Oct 29 2012, 4:18PM
#2
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
Fair enough, 50m. I guess points have been taken from both sides. Actually, I appreciate your deep interest in Classical Music and your contributions to various threads are quite pertinent and substantive.
However, Bernstein is one of my soft spots. I felt compelled to defend his memory along with his artistry. He was a wonderful artist, musician, performer and an amazing personality.
Finally, the 3 big M's have had quite a few (not few) good recordings as well. You may explore their discography, in a more detailed way.
Best wishes,
Parla
Mon, Oct 29 2012, 5:38PM
#3
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
You are blessed Parla seeing and more importantly hearing the *star*conductors under discussion.Like 50milliarden I with regret have not,and if I had like your good self attended a Bernstein concert,no doubt I would have been swept away with the event and be stamping my feet and shouting encore.
It does not follow that, though enjoyable, the performance was true to the composer,or
indeed any good!
Recordings,even live* ones are a different animal then a concert and it is folly to compare.
*A live recording is not what it claims.Typically it is a patchwork edited together from two or more performances.
Mon, Oct 29 2012, 6:21PM
#4
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
BR, if you cannot stand Sibelius' String Quartet in d minor, known as "Voces Intimae", you're missing something quite significant in the opus of the composer. It constitutes his (almost) only masterpiece in the field of Chamber Music. And it is a true masterwork, in any possible way.
I certainly did not claim that I "cannot stand" the quartet (read my post again) - in fact I have always adored the solemn, languid fourth movement. I have had troubles finding in the work the same concentration of thought as exists in the symphonies an some of the tone poems. The first two movements seem little more than a sketch for the original first two of the fifth symphony while the Adagio (which might perhaps benefit from a less monochrome orchestral garb) still strikes me as a failure. I have yet to hear a performance of the finale that delivers the kind of Schubert-esque momentum that JS was obviously striving for.
Is it a masterwork? Not to my ears although, of course, all mature Sibelius is not only worth hearing but better than most other stuff being written at the time.
Tue, Oct 30 2012, 12:36AM
#5
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
BR, the String Quartet in d minor (Voces Intimae) is the only substantive work of Sibelius, composed between the Third and Fourth Symphonies. Exactly like the latter, it is a highly introspective work with a profound, intimate atmosphere, expressed in a way that would be impossible to materialise in a Symphony.
The Quartet's five movements (you never mentioned what you feel for the fourth movement) are thematically interrelated, while each movement keeps its essential distinct air. The passionate Adagio molto (the Third Movement) is the centerpiece of the work with some impressively conceived broad lines and quite emotional lyrical textures. It constitutes a soulful quest for tranquility. However, the genius of the composer is apparent, as he creates a sense of uncertainty in the harmonic progression, as the music enchantingly moves to different keys, sometimes to remote ones from any previous harmonic implication.
The work is quite coherent because of the thematic linkage and so diversified in its five movements by virtue of their independent development and form.
I hope, by the time, with more recordings and with more focus on this truly great composition, you may reach its beauty and significance, particularly for the composer's opus.
Parla
Tue, Oct 30 2012, 12:50AM
#6
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
History Man, the performances I attended, definitely enjoyable, were "true to the composer (almost even to the letter of the score) and as good as it could possibly get. People went nuts even for such a difficult, complex, almost alien work like the String Quartet, op. 131, by Beethoven! Actually, the performances sounded quite close to what we know from the respective recordings of DG of the same period.
What was quite impressive was the joy, the affection and the dedication of the members of VPO under even the slightest gesture of the incredibly expressive Lenny. Unforgettable!
Tue, Oct 30 2012, 6:52PM
#7
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
P, loving the way you express opinions as facts. Very good. ;)
Tue, Oct 30 2012, 10:31PM
#8
RE: Sibelius symhony no.2 and no.5
BR, loving the way you take descriptive elements as opinions. Very good indeed!
Parla
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Parla, when it comes to live performances, you got me cornered, granted (when it comes to recordings too, probably - but I can still try and get my foot in the door there ;))
Not only I was too young in the 70's too attend big name concerts (or at least enjoy them in a mature way), but I've grown to dislike attending live concerts in general over the years. One could call it inverted Glenn Gould syndrome.
I invariably get annoyed by the audience, up to the point that it destroys my enjoyment of the music. Also, the small Dutch provincial town I live in is one of those where even the most mediocre cultural event is like a mating call for all the local self-appointed classy ladies and gents. Don't wanna sound too much like Holden Caulfield here, but damn... I absolutely loathe phonies.
But I admit that having witnessed those big names perform live on stage must have been unforgettable. And I'm sure even an antisocial guy like me would be impressed by their performances and the subsequent recordings.
Btw, I wasn't necessarily talking about the quality of the BPO strings, but about the one-sided emphasis on that quality by HVK, resulting in recordings that sounded awkwardly balanced and unspontaneous. I'm sure that watching him live in concert must have been a more satisfying experience, since the kitchy veneer of his over-postprocessed cd's was absent there.
As for the 3 big M's, I heard too many glossy performances by them, bogged down by false sentiments, wrong accents or just general bad taste to be interested in the couple of white ravens among them, sorry.