Unfinished Business: Schubert
Thu, Feb 7 2013, 5:12PM
#2
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Thanks everyone for these suggestions. Parla I have just raided my old man's collection this afternoon and listened to the 'stormy' Karajan as you nicely put it. Yes, it is stormy!
It's coupled with Dvorak's New World on DG CD. The date of the Schubert is 1965 with the BPO of course which interestingly puts it in the same time-zone as the Bohm with the same orchestra.
I just have one quibble about this Karajan version; the dynamic contrasts in the 1st movement are a bit too dramatic and accentuated for me. The 2nd movement is better in terms of dynamics and the mood is just right.
Not sure yet whether to go for Abbado, Kleiber, Krips etc...The mention of the Furtwangler has got me interested too!
Mark
Fri, Feb 8 2013, 9:19PM
#3
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Today, on the way back from my work, waiting for a traffic light, it's a grey winter day with a bit of wet snow, mp3 of Schubert's Great C-major on the car audio, the 1942 recording with Furtwängler and the BPO.
The moment in the andante where the key changes from A to F major and the horns softly announcing the movement's 2nd theme, one of those marvels in music that makes you wonder how it's possible that four notes of a falling scale (a-g-f-e) can evoke such wealth and depth of emotion... manly tears.
Sound of a car horn behind me breaking the spell.
Sat, Feb 9 2013, 2:18AM
#4
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
That's the Greatness of Schubert, 50m, not any modern, post-modern or avant-garde composer. Unfortunately, for all the great endeavours of other more modern composers in the 20th century and onwards, their projects never reached this "marvels" of music of the Great Classics, which, no matter how many times you listen to or how simple they may sound at times, you'll never feel bored or the same.
Parla
Sat, Feb 9 2013, 2:25PM
#5
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Nope, I'm not gonna bite.
Sat, Feb 9 2013, 4:27PM
#6
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
You don't have to. There is no "bait"! (Just Schubert's Great).
Parla
Mon, Feb 11 2013, 8:40PM
#7
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Thanks again everyone. I've gone for Kleiber/VPO on DG CD and Harnoncourt with Concertgebouw on Apex. For the moment!
50ml/78 rpm - the Furtwangler is there on Amazon, at a high price of circa £25. It'll be going in the basket at some point!
John - that disc of the other unfinished symphonic works looks like it will be going in the basket as well.
Mark
PS I have to admit I passed up on Abbado boxed set on Friday with COE at M'cr HMV. Not sure about a boxed set just yet!
Tue, Feb 12 2013, 8:40AM
#8
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
I don't know how far you wish to go, Mark, but the J. Nott with the Bamberger S.O. is a stunning performance, in a superb and very detailed recording (SACD), on Tudor. His cycle is the best recorded and his performances are very reliable and exciting. Don't be discouraged by the orchestra and his underrated or less known name. His discography has some extraordinary CDs (Mahler, Bruckner, Stravinsky) and no flops.
Parla
Tue, Feb 12 2013, 2:52PM
#9
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Partsong, check this from Amazon/US: http://www.amazon.com/Schubert-Symphony-No-Haydn-88/dp/B000001GQR/ref=sr... (There are several other options at Amz/Maketplace including shops from Europe)
This is the historic recording of the great to have. Buy, buy, buy!
Tue, Feb 12 2013, 4:07PM
#10
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Thanks for that 78rpm. I've just ordered it at a tender price of £7.50 from Amazon UK!
Mark
Sat, Feb 16 2013, 7:01PM
#11
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
The Kleiber/VPO and Harnoncourt/Concertgebouw have duly arrived. Furtwangler's 9th alas has not yet arrived.
The comparison of different versions of the Unfinished is throwing up some very interesting differences in terms of timings of the 1st movement, which in itself is of course an indication about different tempi taken by conductors:
To clarify
Cantelli/Philharmonia 10.51
Karajan/BPO 11.28
Kleiber/VPO 13.56
Harnoncourt/Concertgebouw 14.56
Now that's a heck of a difference - 4 minutes between the Cantelli and Harnoncourt in the first movement of a symphony!
The Kleiber/VPO is a very fine performance - great refinement in the VPO's playing (1979 DG). A touch fast in one or two places - though its overall timing would suggest not - eg towards the end of the exposition 1st movement. I have yet to listen to the Harnoncourt.
What I'm really looking for is a performance that brings out that brooding intensity in this piece without being too fast or overblown in terms of loud/soft contrasts. I know I'm being pernickety - the Karajan is very strong but I just feel that his contrasts are a bit OTT. The Drama is in the music if you know what I mean.
On the Gramophone website here there are critics' choices to a number of composers now including as I'm sure you all know Beethoven and Bruckner. It'll be interesting to see when the Schubert one comes out which is the choice on the Unfinished.
So my search for the best Unfinished goes on! And then there are other Schubert symphonies to explore (the Kleiber is coupled with the third instead of the more usual fifth, which is the case with Bohm and Harnoncourt).
Mark
Sat, Feb 16 2013, 7:40PM
#12
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Mark, there is an exposition repeat in the Schubert 8th. Whether that is taken or not accounts I think for the big differences in timing that you noted!
I still find Böhm as fine as anyone in this lovely music - just the right balance between power and beauty!
Chris
http://imslp.org/wiki/Symphony_No.8,_D.759_(Schubert,_Franz)
Sat, Feb 16 2013, 9:33PM
#13
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Hi Chris! Thanks for that. Yeh it could be. I'll have to listen again!
Mark
Sun, Feb 17 2013, 12:28AM
#14
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Evening gents! I haven't listened to the unfinished for a while and the only recording I own is Sinopoli and the Philharmonia. I will listen to it again soon and try some other versions.
I went and heard the ninth in C Major tonight at a concert played by the Polish National Radio Symphony Orchestra and it reminded me of what I once read about Schubert's "heavenly length" (although I think that referred to a piano sonata). Not one superfluous note despite it lasting a good hour. It was spellbinding throughout. If he had lived a full life he would surely have returned to the unfinished and made it into something equally "great" and then gone on to write goodness knows how many symphonies, giving us so many more works of genius. I've ordered the re-construction of his tenth played by Mackerras and it will interesting to see what to make of it. Of all the great composers who died young I believe we were robbed of the most in Schubert.
Anyway Mark, when you find your favourite unfinished let us know!
Cheers
Graham
Sun, Feb 17 2013, 10:01AM
#15
RE: Unfinished Business: Schubert
Mark, I'm not sure if there are some repeats noted in some "lengthy" performances, but, there are quite a few recordings where the first movement goes up to the 15 minute mark (Abbado, Nott) apart from the one you mentioned, while in some others the slow movement reaches almost the mark of 14 minutes.
For me, the issue is how convincing the performance can be regardless of the pace. Both Abbado and Nott are absolutely convincing and thrilling in their accounts and in brilliant recordings.
By the way, Mark, the Karajan I meant is the second one on EMI (there is also an older one with Philharmonia on EMI of 1955) and not the old one on DG. You may try this one as well. It's less stormy than the first one, more polished and well recorded. It might fit in your perception of the work.
Parla
The 1942 live recording of the 9th is even more electrifying, but the 1951 studio recording may be a tad more balanced, and it has the benefit of a better recording. Choosing between those two legendary performances is impossible, at least for me.